Web Connection Wishlist
More on COM servers
Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. More on COM servers
  FoxInCloud Support - Thierry N.
  All
  Sep 19, 2014 @ 07:48am
On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  Rick Strahl
  Thierry Nivelet (FoxInCloud)
  Sep 19, 2014 @ 10:05am

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals




Rick Strahl
West Wind Technologies

Making waves on the Web
from Maui

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  FoxInCloud Support - Thierry N.
  Rick Strahl
  Sep 19, 2014 @ 10:16am
.net -vs- ISAPI: sure, it's normal

Load could be seen as:
Cumulated processing time / Total time elapsed sine server started / # of processors

FoxinCloud retrieves the # of processors, I'll post the code ASAP

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals





-- thn (FoxInCloud)

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  Rick Strahl
  Thierry Nivelet (FoxInCloud)
  Sep 27, 2014 @ 02:18am
Well, that doesn't really tell you a real time number.

However, after giving this some thought I've updated the server admin form for the Web Connection .NET Module so that it displays more useful information more cleanly:

Note there's now a real time CPU value displayed for each server instance running based on Windows performance counters so you can see at a glance how busy this particular server is and how much CPU it's using. This works both for COM and file based servers.

If you're interested you can grab the latest module from:

http://west-wind.com/files/WebConnectionExperimental.zip

It'll contain an updated version of WebConnectionModule.dll that can be dropped into the BIN folder.

+++ Rick ---


.net -vs- ISAPI: sure, it's normal

Load could be seen as:
Cumulated processing time / Total time elapsed sine server started / # of processors

FoxinCloud retrieves the # of processors, I'll post the code ASAP

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals







Rick Strahl
West Wind Technologies

Making waves on the Web
from Maui

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  FoxInCloud Support - Thierry N.
  Rick Strahl
  Sep 30, 2014 @ 09:23am
Great, thanks
I'll try this version with wc4 (should work, no?)

What about adding an average request duration column?


Well, that doesn't really tell you a real time number.

However, after giving this some thought I've updated the server admin form for the Web Connection .NET Module so that it displays more useful information more cleanly:

Note there's now a real time CPU value displayed for each server instance running based on Windows performance counters so you can see at a glance how busy this particular server is and how much CPU it's using. This works both for COM and file based servers.

If you're interested you can grab the latest module from:

http://west-wind.com/files/WebConnectionExperimental.zip

It'll contain an updated version of WebConnectionModule.dll that can be dropped into the BIN folder.

+++ Rick ---


.net -vs- ISAPI: sure, it's normal

Load could be seen as:
Cumulated processing time / Total time elapsed sine server started / # of processors

FoxinCloud retrieves the # of processors, I'll post the code ASAP

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals








-- thn (FoxInCloud)

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  Rick Strahl
  Thierry Nivelet (FoxInCloud)
  Sep 30, 2014 @ 05:48pm

Not sure how useful an average would be. What does that really tell you? If you have thousands of requests and you got some that take two seconds and others that take 1 millisecond how does the average help you with anything useful?

It's basically the cumulative/hits... What's there now is a metric so you can get an idea that the service is running, how long it's been running and how busy it's been.

+++ Rick ---



Great, thanks
I'll try this version with wc4 (should work, no?)

What about adding an average request duration column?


Well, that doesn't really tell you a real time number.

However, after giving this some thought I've updated the server admin form for the Web Connection .NET Module so that it displays more useful information more cleanly:

Note there's now a real time CPU value displayed for each server instance running based on Windows performance counters so you can see at a glance how busy this particular server is and how much CPU it's using. This works both for COM and file based servers.

If you're interested you can grab the latest module from:

http://west-wind.com/files/WebConnectionExperimental.zip

It'll contain an updated version of WebConnectionModule.dll that can be dropped into the BIN folder.

+++ Rick ---


.net -vs- ISAPI: sure, it's normal

Load could be seen as:
Cumulated processing time / Total time elapsed sine server started / # of processors

FoxinCloud retrieves the # of processors, I'll post the code ASAP

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals










Rick Strahl
West Wind Technologies

Making waves on the Web
from Maui

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  FoxInCloud Support - Thierry N.
  Rick Strahl
  Oct 1, 2014 @ 02:41am
In case a customer worries about response time, having an average is nice;
also to easily track response time evolution after an optimization
(a total/average line would also be welcome)

Not sure how useful an average would be. What does that really tell you? If you have thousands of requests and you got some that take two seconds and others that take 1 millisecond how does the average help you with anything useful?

It's basically the cumulative/hits... What's there now is a metric so you can get an idea that the service is running, how long it's been running and how busy it's been.

+++ Rick ---



Great, thanks
I'll try this version with wc4 (should work, no?)

What about adding an average request duration column?


Well, that doesn't really tell you a real time number.

However, after giving this some thought I've updated the server admin form for the Web Connection .NET Module so that it displays more useful information more cleanly:

Note there's now a real time CPU value displayed for each server instance running based on Windows performance counters so you can see at a glance how busy this particular server is and how much CPU it's using. This works both for COM and file based servers.

If you're interested you can grab the latest module from:

http://west-wind.com/files/WebConnectionExperimental.zip

It'll contain an updated version of WebConnectionModule.dll that can be dropped into the BIN folder.

+++ Rick ---


.net -vs- ISAPI: sure, it's normal

Load could be seen as:
Cumulated processing time / Total time elapsed sine server started / # of processors

FoxinCloud retrieves the # of processors, I'll post the code ASAP

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals











-- thn (FoxInCloud)

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  Rick Strahl
  Thierry Nivelet (FoxInCloud)
  Oct 1, 2014 @ 03:20pm

Sorry - that just doesn't sound useful to me and there's kind of limited space of what can be added. The info you see here is supposed to tell you the running status of the server and some indication of how it's currently running. The average in 90% of the time is going to be totally useless because most sites have such high variance between request lengths that an average doesn't mean anything. Averages are useful for individual requests of the same type but across a site? not so much.

+++ Rick ---



In case a customer worries about response time, having an average is nice;
also to easily track response time evolution after an optimization
(a total/average line would also be welcome)

Not sure how useful an average would be. What does that really tell you? If you have thousands of requests and you got some that take two seconds and others that take 1 millisecond how does the average help you with anything useful?

It's basically the cumulative/hits... What's there now is a metric so you can get an idea that the service is running, how long it's been running and how busy it's been.

+++ Rick ---



Great, thanks
I'll try this version with wc4 (should work, no?)

What about adding an average request duration column?


Well, that doesn't really tell you a real time number.

However, after giving this some thought I've updated the server admin form for the Web Connection .NET Module so that it displays more useful information more cleanly:

Note there's now a real time CPU value displayed for each server instance running based on Windows performance counters so you can see at a glance how busy this particular server is and how much CPU it's using. This works both for COM and file based servers.

If you're interested you can grab the latest module from:

http://west-wind.com/files/WebConnectionExperimental.zip

It'll contain an updated version of WebConnectionModule.dll that can be dropped into the BIN folder.

+++ Rick ---


.net -vs- ISAPI: sure, it's normal

Load could be seen as:
Cumulated processing time / Total time elapsed sine server started / # of processors

FoxinCloud retrieves the # of processors, I'll post the code ASAP

If added this will only go into the .NET Module, not the ISAPI one.

Average time we could probably do. Load - not so much since that value is expensive to retrieve and would have to be store per request. So that's not going to happen. We can show last request CPU load, but that's not really all that useful either since by the time you read that value it may already be in the next request or alternately if no request comes in close to idle. I have to check and see what the Process class provides - it might have some static slightly out of date info for this natively.

+++ Rick ---



On the 'Web Connection ISAPI Configuration' page, when running in COM mode, could we have these 2 extra columns, and a totals line?

COM Servers
Hits
Active
Cumulative
Average && Average request response time in sec.
Started
% Load && Average CPU load (= cumulative / (seconds since started))
PID
Action

Totals line would:
- sum Hits, Active and Cumulative,
- calculate Average and %Load on the totals













Rick Strahl
West Wind Technologies

Making waves on the Web
from Maui

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  FoxInCloud Support - Thierry N.
  Rick Strahl
  Oct 2, 2014 @ 01:50am
Hi Rick,
Very impressed how you can guess other's need better than themselves!
Aloha,

The average in 90% of the time is going to be totally useless because most sites have such high variance between request lengths that an average doesn't mean anything. Averages are useful for individual requests of the same type but across a site? not so much.

+++ Rick ---


-- thn (FoxInCloud)

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  Rick Strahl
  Thierry Nivelet (FoxInCloud)
  Oct 2, 2014 @ 03:49pm

I don't need your sarcasm Thierry...

I have a pretty good idea what's needed to know the status of an app. There's only a limited amount of space to display stuff, and tracking request times requires capturing additional data on every request which is all overhead that we don't need for a questionable feature.

If you need better statistics look at the IIS log data - it's all there...

+++ Rick ---



Hi Rick,
Very impressed how you can guess other's need better than themselves!
Aloha,

The average in 90% of the time is going to be totally useless because most sites have such high variance between request lengths that an average doesn't mean anything. Averages are useful for individual requests of the same type but across a site? not so much.

+++ Rick ---




Rick Strahl
West Wind Technologies

Making waves on the Web
from Maui

Gravatar is a globally recognized avatar based on your email address. Re: More on COM servers
  FoxInCloud Support - Thierry N.
  Rick Strahl
  Oct 3, 2014 @ 02:04am
OK, I'll explain more
FoxInCloud clients seldom use IIS or wConnect logging, and IIS logging is far too complex to use efficiently (includes all hits including images, CSS, etc.).
When we jump to a FoxInCloud app, we need a quick overview of how it operates, eg response times and CPU loads.
Here is what I have in mind (taken from a real-life production site), and the corresponding Excel Workbook with formulas
Thanks

I don't need your sarcasm Thierry...

I have a pretty good idea what's needed to know the status of an app. There's only a limited amount of space to display stuff, and tracking request times requires capturing additional data on every request which is all overhead that we don't need for a questionable feature.

If you need better statistics look at the IIS log data - it's all there...

+++ Rick ---



Hi Rick,
Very impressed how you can guess other's need better than themselves!
Aloha,

The average in 90% of the time is going to be totally useless because most sites have such high variance between request lengths that an average doesn't mean anything. Averages are useful for individual requests of the same type but across a site? not so much.

+++ Rick ---




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